Life Science Marketing Radio Chris Conner

Susanna Harris is the Director of Community at Breakout Ventures. She is also the Founder of PhD Balance, a collaborative community empowering graduate students to build their personal and professional resilience and the 2023 recipient of the SAMPS Young Person of the Year Award.
This episode is a little different. For the last couple of years, I have interviewed the winner of that SAMPS award on this podcast. Susanna has been a guest before and although we’ve chatted a few times since and both live in the Bay Area, we had never met face to face. Susanna mentioned hiking in one of our calls so I thought this would be an opportunity try something new. I suggested we meet up for a hike and record some stuff along the way. Thank you Susanna for being game for one more experiment.
We had a free-flowing conversation covering our inspirations in science, science communication, marketing, career paths, longevity, mental health, and more. AI, psychedelics and The Andromeda Strain all came up as well. Give it a listen to find out the context.
I typically focus these episodes around a theme and try to point toward a specific takeaway. While there is a thread to the topics we discussed, the takeaway for me this time was simply about the value of conversation. I trust that the listeners to this podcast will learn something about each of us and may be prompted to think about something they heard from a new perspective.
As a listener, you don’t have to be part of a conversation to benefit from it. That’s the magic of this medium. You can listen in as if you were there. Taking that beyond podcasts, consider the value of people listening to your team members, executives and subject matter experts in their natural, unscripted style. Podcast listeners report (and I can verify this both as a host and a listener) that they feel like they know the people they hear from regularly. There is a level of know, like, and trust that is hard to replicate except face-to-face.
Finally, one never knows where having a conversation will lead in the long run. I don’t even remember how Susanna and I connected initially. Yet here we were, 3 years later, hiking the hills, sharing our experiences in science and creating unique content along the way. If we get a chance to help one another out in the future, that would be icing on the cake. It all started with a conversation.
Mentioned in this episode:
Books: Where Good Ideas Come From by Steven Johnson
The End of the World is Just The Beginning by Peter Zeihan
Movie: The Andromeda Strain (also a book by Michael Crichton)
Your deepest insights are your best branding. I’d love to help you share them. Chat with me about custom content for your life science brand. Or visit my website.




This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit cclifescience.substack.com

Jeffrey Kiplinger is the co-founder and partner at Selling Science, a consulting firm dedicated to helping life science, contract research, and tools companies boost revenue by building and optimizing their scientific sales teams. He is also the author of the book "Expert to Entrepreneur."
Jeff shared his personal journey from obtaining a PhD in organic chemistry in the late '80s to his corporate experience with Pfizer. He highlighted the frustrations he faced being siloed in his role and the desire to take his expertise on the road.
I appreciate his perspective on the disconnect many scientists face when building businesses. I guess I would say, your expertise is the product, but it is not the business. I’m still chewing on that one as I think there is a lot to be learned from that. Jeff emphasized the importance of viewing the business as an entity itself, separate from the scientific expertise it offers, and focusing on growing the business side.
Personally, I find marketing easy (talking about what I do). But sales is hard (asking for money). We talked about that and how to find the right people for your offering, stressing the need to identify the ideal customer and tailor marketing efforts to address their specific problems.
What is, what do you do that's provided real value for your customers in the past? And the easiest way to find that out is to ask them. And that's also something that we're terrified of doing.
I asked him about a quote from Brian Tracy. “Sales is just a transfer of enthusiasm.” When you believe in what you have, you can have a conversation and talk about why you are enthusiastic. But first you need to find out if the person in front of you has a problem you can solve.
If you find this helpful, it kind of makes sense to subscribe, doesn’t it?
Thanks for spending some time here, either way.
The conversation also touched on hiring experienced salespeople, both within and outside the scientific domain, and the critical factor of finding the perfect customer. Jeff outlined the significance of defining an ideal customer profile, which guides marketing efforts and ensures a more focused and effective approach. Does the salespersons skills and experience match what you are trying to do? Do they have the right mix of science and sales expertise? For example, selling from a catalog is different from selling a solution comprising components from a catalog.
If you're buying somebody's expertise in your science and they can't sell, that's a wasted investment. If you're buying somebody's network and their network isn't your ideal customer base, that's a waste.
…I guess what I see is when people hire experienced sales reps or senior people who've already got field experience, very frequently they're not looking at whether that person is a match for what you're trying to achieve. They might be a match for your company, they might be a match in terms of the revenue they've produced in the past, but are you really checking them against what the company is trying to do?
If you are on the road to selling your hard-earned scientific expertise, you should definitely give this episode a listen.
Your deepest insights are your best branding. I’d love to help you share them. Chat with me about custom content for your life science brand. Or visit my website.


This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit cclifescience.substack.com

Note: For this episode, I asked ChatGPT to write a summary based on the transcript of our conversation. I enjoy doing these interviews and consider myself a decent writer. However, it takes a lot of time each week to write a summary that I find minimally satisfying and acceptable. You deserve better and I can put my efforts to better use elsewhere or upgrading the whole experience here. I did lightly edit this to make it sound as if I could have written it. This is my second attempt following some feedback from a respected colleague (you know who you are). I’m beginning to see how my own style differs from ChatGPT, even if what it produces is perfectly readable, but somewhat less memorable. Let me know what you think in the comments.
Miranda Lipton is a talented freelance writer, photographer, and multimedia storyteller. In this episode we talked about earned media from a freelancer's perspective, focusing on how companies can collaborate with freelancers to get their stories published in widely read publications. Our discussion centered around Miranda's recent success in securing a feature in Fast Company about cultivated meat from fish. Our conversation should be enlightening for both freelancers and the companies that work with them.
Miranda's Journey into Freelance Writing
Miranda journey into freelance writing began in high school, and continued at the local town newspaper, a path that eventually led her to major in journalism at Ohio State University. Her desire to explore different facets of storytelling, including writing and photography, drove her to the freelance world.
The Genesis of the Lab-Grown Fish Story
Miranda's fascination with food sustainability and innovation in the past few years led her to investigate the idea lab-grown fish. The idea for the article emerged from a deep dive into the world of lab-grown meat, a concept that had been around for nearly a decade. Miranda recognized a gap in coverage, particularly in the realm of lab-grown fish, which was an emerging and innovative field. This, combined with her passion for food sustainability, created the perfect recipe (ChatGPT made a pun!) for a compelling story. She did her research and interviewed folks at relevant companies, eventually leading to the publication of her story in Fast Company.
The Art of Pitching to Publications
I was curious about the pitch process. How did she get an articled idea accepted at Fast Company? She utilizes a consistent pitch outline, typically comprising two to three paragraphs that encapsulate the essence of the story. Miranda stressed the importance of familiarity with the publication's focus. In her case, she had been an avid reader of Fast Company for years, allowing her to confidently identify the magazine as an ideal platform for her lab-grown fish story. .
Navigating Interviews with Companies
While pitching to publications can be challenging, arranging interviews is more straightforward. Companies are generally eager to discuss their work. Her process involves reaching out to individuals at relevant companies, often beginning with CEOs or co-founders identified through LinkedIn. Of course, it’s important to gather a diverse range of perspectives to provide a well-rounded view of the subject.
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Feedback and Challenges
I asked her if she had gotten any feedback. While direct feedback from readers is not common, she occasionally receives emails from individuals who have read her articles. The overarching response to her articles on topics like lab-grown and 3D-printed food often revolves around skepticism and the novelty of the subjects. Many readers express interest in these innovations as well as uncertainty about trying them. The unfamiliarity of concepts such as 3D-printed food explains their hesitation. She thinks that as research in these fields progresses, more people will embrace these innovations. I have s

All of us in the life sciences are in the business of making the world healthier. The instruments and reagents we sell and the technologies and therapies that result save lives.
A scientist (after a lot of research) will look at a disease or problem and say, “I think I can find a way to fix that.”
Can we, as an industry, look at trade shows like a scientist would, and ask, “How can we do this better and stick to our mission of making the world at least less sick if not healthier?”
If you’ve been with me for a while, you know I have a love-hate relationship with trade shows. When I was a MarCom director, events were by far the biggest part of my budget. I imagined all the other awesome campaigns I could execute with that money. And then there is the waste. The stuff that ends up in the hotel trash before you get back on the plane and the shipping of huge amounts of equipment all over the world.
On the other hand, if a lot of customers are going to be in one place at the same time… it makes sense to take your offering to them. And human connection is important.
I know it’s important because this episode came out of my trip to ADLM, the event formerly known as AACC.
Stuart Warrington is the CEO of Envoke. They create virtual demos to make your instruments accessible at more events and present a consistent story across the customer journey. More on that below.
Stuart is a filmmaker. He has been created videos for the likes of Thermo and Bio-Rad. Videos used to have a longer useful lifespan. Then his customers wanted new content at a faster pace that was more engaging. Stuart suggested video games.
“No. That’s not it.”
“How about a virtual demo?
“Yes!”
It turns out those are basically the same thing just packaged differently. (They are both virtual experiences that tell a story with the user as the hero.) Stories are the key here. (The crowd cheers.)
People need to tell their own story, right? And sales and training and all that is about that. It's like, how can I communicate the message of what this thing does in the most accurate possible way? And you need to give people freedom to craft that story. And that's why we do things the way we do them.
We make this story block library and it's loads of little clips. And in each clip tells its own individual message. And then your user, your sales rep, your engineer, your trainer can take from that library and craft this story. It might be about a really specific bit of qPCR on the qPCR devices in the platform. And you know your customer only really cares about that. So we give you the opportunity to just pull those bits in and tell a story that is about your product with your product rather than PowerPoint presentations and brochures and videos and things like that. It just takes that to a slightly higher level and it also then starts saving you loads of money on shipping. Right?
The result is that consistent experience for the user from the web to sales to training to maintenance and service. We talked about training people the same way pilots train. On a simulation. They can make mistakes without breaking an expensive piece of kit.
Not subscribed yet? It would mean a lot to me.
Thanks for spending some time here, either way.
In addition to the contribution to sustainability without shipping products, the ability to customize a story improves the sales process.
So one of our customers built a storyline for the event from the story block library. So they built something that was like, this is what we want to talk about. This is the story we're telling here. But then what it also did was they put on a QR code, so that you scan the QR code as your customer, and what you do is, you walk away with a different storyline that's specific for you, that's just about the thing that you were talking to him about.
It's all come from the same place, we've just pitched it slightly differently. So it's all come from that story block library, we've just created speci

I traveled to Disneyland Orange County for AACC ADLM back in July to connect with a few folks and walk the floors of the exhibit hall. I was on my way out when Derek Hamre from Launchworks CDMO stood up at his table and got my attention with the best elevator pitch I have ever heard. And that landed him a spot on my podcast. I’ll share what it was at the end of this post.*
Imagine this scenario. You’re in an academic lab or small biotech and you’ve developed a diagnostic test for a molecule or a disease. How do you go about commercializing your test?
Do you need to get a bunch of regulatory approvals? What else do you need to think about? After all, you’re in a small research lab stepping into a whole new world. It turns out there are people who do this for a living and can help you plan out your strategy.
Launchworks is a CDMO for molecular diagnostics. Services range from commercialization strategy and supply chain management through to fulfillment. A company might come to them with a locked down bill of materials and work instructions for kitting tens to hundreds of thousands of units at a time, or maybe they are early in the process and need help thinking through strategy from the beginning.
…one of the reasons that we are pretty present at ADLM, AACC is the RUO kits. Those that are taking an idea from the R&D space and bringing it to the market and that commercialization process is a big, you know, lift for a lot of companies, even if they're bigger. Um, but especially for smaller companies when they have 5, 10 workers that have never gone through the commercialization process.
Beyond that, what level of regulatory approval do they want? In some cases, a kit might be sold as RUO (Research Use Only), but a customer’s customer might want to take it further:
And a lot of our customers, so we won't make those claims, obviously, our customers will go through the FDA filings or whatever, um, but some of our customers will just not want to go through the FDA process, so they'll make their kit RUO and then maybe one of their customers will buy the kit and then go through the FDA or 510K, PMA process… …so allowing another customer or their companies that they're working with to go through that process on their behalf might be the pathway for them.
Regardless of the regulatory path chosen, Derek described the four main areas where a CDMO can help get a product to market.
* Risk mitigation
* Commercialization strategy
* Manufacturing process
* Supply chain
You’d like to avoid surprises in any of those areas. Taking supply chain, for example, it would be important to know if a supplier might be closing shop in the near future. Will you be able to maintain quality as you scale up?
I asked Derek about the logistics of assembling and shipping hundreds of thousands of units from different vendors. Everything is done in-house. Mixing buffers, putting kits in bags, labeling and shipping. Launchworks has about a 30,000 to 40,000 square foot facility in Beverly, Massachusetts.
Prior to this I knew that there were CDMOs for pharma, but not for diagnostics. ADLM was an eye opener in terms of the world of clinical chemistry. And this isn’t the only episode I recorded as a result of that visit. More in a couple weeks.
*I don’t remember his exact words, but it was along the lines of “We’re helping visitors to ADLM become vendors at ADLM.”
Your deepest insights are your best branding. I’d love to help you share them. Chat with me about custom content for your life science brand. Or visit my website.
Intro Music stefsax / CC BY 2.5



This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit cclifescience.substack.com

Jamie Gier is the Chief Marketing Officer at Dexcare, responsible for establishing the company as a category leader in modernizing the way consumers discover, access, and choose their healthcare services – from digital search to booking an appointment.
We enjoyed a wide-ranging discussion about marketing beginning with selling high-value products with long sales cycles and multiple decision makers. You’ve heard it before, but no one wants to be sold to. That’s the expressway to the delete button. Jamie emphasized building relationships and educating, showing customers how their lives could be better.
At Dexcare, her team learns a lot from early adopters about why they chose their product and continue to use it. Ask as many questions as you can, just like we talked about last week… We don’t know what we don’t know.
Jamie and her team are taking advantage of thought leadership in a big way.
We happen to spend a big portion of our media budget on LinkedIn, for example, that happens to be the channel where a lot of our buyers are, and there's a lot of thought leadership.
And so if anything, we've really focused our paid media on a single channel and we want to get really, really good at that. And so that's where we're placing a lot of our investments, but it's one of many. We know as soon as we capture their attention, a relationship begins. And that's where we have to start developing even higher levels of trust and rapport beyond just what they see with us in a digital way….we spend a lot of time with our clients simply promoting their own thought leadership on these topics.
That's number one. Two, we do spend time on building content that is education- rich.
Measurement is important and of course. I asked her how she makes the case for the tactics that are harder to measure. Observation and paying attention. When you land a large deal because someone heard about you on a podcast, that’s a pretty good sign.
Not subscribed yet? Can we fix that?
Thanks for spending some time here, either way.
Jamie thinks that because of the emphasis on measurement, marketers have moved away from creativity. That took us on a little side trip to talk about Jimmy Buffett, who died right before this interview, and storytelling. I had written a piece for LinkedIn (not posted) about the impact JB had on my career. (DM me for details).
Besides writing fun songs about pirates and exotic places, Jimmy’s clever use of language to make emotional connections set him apart. Jamie said:
The thing about Jimmy Buffett is he brought you into his world, or he went into yours. And that was the power of the words he used in his songs.
With one top-10 hit (not even close to his best song) Jimmy Buffett built a business empire around his collection of memorable characters and events. We should try to do the same.
What advice does Jamie have for marketers just getting started?
* Join communities where you can learn. (I recommend SAMPS) and
* Don’t be intimidated by people with advanced degrees. They may know a lot in a technical field that took years of study. And you know (and love) marketing! Learn what you can from them, but also show them how you can help them with what you know. Science doesn’t get sold without storytelling.
Your deepest insights are your best branding. I’d love to help you share them. Chat with me about custom content for your life science brand. Or visit my website.
Intro Music stefsax / CC BY 2.5


This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit cclifescience.substack.com